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Transcript

Ryan Eaton: Welcome to the insurance leadership podcast. I'm Ryan Eaton, your host and honored to have you listening in today. We have Mark Lampen with health insurance specialist, a great friend and partner of Morgan white group for many years. He has a great general agency out of Missouri. And today we have him hitting on some of the benefits of working with a small general agency. He has brought a lot of value to us over the years, and I think he'll bring a lot of value to you in this episode. Thank you for listening in.

Mark, my friend, welcome to the show, buddy.

Mark Lampen: Hey, thanks, Ryan. I appreciate being on always good to chat with you.

Ryan Eaton: Man, it's an honor to have you on here today and I'm fired up about our conversation and you and I obviously good friends, I think today's going to be a lot of fun looking forward to going through this, but let's get started. Tell us about what brought you into the industry and how long you've been in the business now.

Mark Lampen: So I actually came into the industry. 33 years ago, straight out of college, didn't know what I was going to do. Engaged to get married. My father in law told me you better go find a job so, I love sales. So I actually hooked on with prudential insurance right out of college. Spent six months there selling life insurance. Didn't like it at all, of course. Nobody really likes selling life insurance right out of college, but it got me started in the sales, and I really I'm a numbers guy I was a finance major. About six months after I started that I hooked on with golden rule insurance. I went in there as a service rep, of all things, not even into sales. And that really taught me a lot of what has transposed over the last 33 years, because we were dealing with agents all over the country, calling in, asking about product, going over the ins and the outs, so it really trained myself to talk to brokers, as opposed to talking to the end consumer. And that really excited me, I enjoyed it and about a year after that, I got hired on the sales side. And it spent, a couple, two, three more years with Golden Rule, but it was a great experience and really exposed me in great training with that company. To, like I say, it gave me a good base of what transpired in the next 30 years after Golden Rule.

Ryan Eaton: That's right. That's awesome.

Mark Lampen: Yeah, I wasn't looking to get an insurance business right out of college, but I needed a job.

Ryan Eaton: Like a lot of people, right? That's so how long have you had your shop that you have now?

Mark Lampen: So we just celebrated 20 years last month on my own.

Ryan Eaton: That is awesome.

Mark Lampen: It's been, a lot of changes, a lot of heartaches, ups and downs and blood, sweat and tears, as but I wouldn't have tried it for anything.

Ryan Eaton: So what made you start your own company instead of sticking with the kind of the corporate route, so to say?

Mark Lampen: Sure. Yeah, I was definitely not a corporate guy. I enjoyed going out and meeting the brokers and not sticking to their script that they wanted me to do. So I got actually hired away from Golden Rule by a local general agent here in St. Louis, and they were marketing Washington National, which was a competitor at that time. It's all individual health. That's all we did was individual health. And that was a great experience. And that, after Washington National, they got bought out by another company, Connecticut National. That then got bought out by Conceco. And this was all under the same general agency. And I know my two bosses at the time. They were getting tired of getting bought out, they started spreading their wings into life and mortgages and this and that just wasn't my cup of tea. I love the health insurance business. Everybody complains about health insurance rates and I felt like that's where I belong.

So after the last company said, Hey, can see go, they couldn't find a buyer for their book of business. They were out of the health insurance market, so I went out and I became good friends with the company rep Steve Shaw with American Community they were in great little insurance carrier out of Michigan, good reputation, good products, and I just went to Steve I told what happened. And he goes let me give you a general agent contract, go out and market so that's how I got involved.

Ryan Eaton: Okay.

Mark Lampen: My own thing. Is a leap of faith, things I always believe things happen for a reason and when that door closed with the old agency and I opened up my own, I had three kids at the time scared, but you know what? I wouldn't have changed it looking back on it.

Ryan Eaton: Mark, was it harder than you thought getting started or starting your own agency? Or were you pretty motivated because you had three kids at the house and you'd make sure you fit?

Mark Lampen: That's a motivator, definitely. But, I wouldn't say it was easy, but I wouldn't say it was hard. It was hard work, a lot of hours. But the thing that I had formed is I had so many agent contacts that I had over the 10, 13 years working with the other carriers and stuff that I've built up and had a reputation out there, good reputation, thank God, out in the field with the brokers, they trusted me. In the company I hooked on with to become a general agent, I believed them, they were a great regional company, small company, it wasn't a big United Healthcare of Blue Cross, something needed to be changed or get done. It could be done a lot quicker than going through all the red tape that some of these other carriers, big carriers had to go through so I really love that philosophy and we rode that train for, several years.

Ryan Eaton: That's awesome. I'm a big believer in your process. I love how you started on the carrier side, I'm a big fan of people starting on the carrier side or a big agency side, learning the systems and the processes, starting off, starting the company, starting an agency when you have no experience to me is just a bad idea because there's so many different, ditches you'll get into but I like having a few years of experience in different things before you start your own and like you said, you had broker contacts already from what you were doing, it makes it so much easier if you've already got some of that experience in those relationships, when you are starting your general agency.

Mark Lampen: Yeah, absolutely. And that was the big thing. And it's still hard work to this day, I don't take anything for granted. There's too many carriers out there, and, I want to be in front of these brokers constantly and show them my service and stuff.

Ryan Eaton: That's right. I tell everybody insurance is one of the best businesses in the world, we're selling paper with a promise and there's no inventory residual I love it. I still think it's one of the best there is.

Mark Lampen: Absolutely.

Ryan Eaton: Look, so today I've talked to you about this already. What I wanted to get into. For those listening in today. There has been so many acquisitions in the insurance business over the last three or four years, there was, I think, 1100 two years ago, 900 the year before that, I think 800 year before that. I'm not sure what the 2023 numbers are off the cuff and then also 2024 numbers but there has been so many acquisitions. We've seen large companies get larger, right? I think even one of the large general agencies across the country was buying three agencies a week. And when you think about that a hundred, I don't even know how you can meet all the people in that amount of time, much less go through the books, the numbers, everything else there is to it. I wanted to hit with you today, Mark, get into, you have a general agency, you have a company that goes out and recruits brokers and you differentiate yourself and you've been successful, you have family even working in the business. You've got a great reputation in the market. And I wanted to get with you today to hit. What are the differences maybe when working with a big general agency and then also working with your kind of, your local agency, so to say, your guy who may have 5 to 10 people in a shop versus maybe 5, 000 people in a shop, right? And so that's what I really want to make it about. And so the 1st question I have for you today is how do you differentiate yourself when you're meeting with brokers or when you're going into an agency from the big, large companies that are out there?

Mark Lampen: A couple of things. Number one, I say, I try to stay right in my lane, Ryan by that, I don't want to be everything to everybody. I don't need 10 dental carriers, 10 vision carriers, 10 light carriers. I know what I'm good at. I know the products that I bring to the table are quality products. They're going to help the agent make the sale. Preserve maybe a group, what have you. So I know I'm bringing the right products to them. I don't need, I'll tell them to go find that big brokerage agency for life, dental, whatever it may be. I know you guys do a lot of that stuff and I probably should be turning business your way but to me, that just gives too much static to what I do.

Ryan Eaton: Yeah, I get it.

Mark Lampen: We gap insurance with Morgan White's by far biggest product, but we do a little bit of level funded, but it's with a twist it's the reference based pricing. So we try to differentiate ourself with a product like that. We've just brought in a new individual product for self employed and 1099 workers, which is brand new to the market so for those high income earners, we've got something, but we don't want to be everything to everybody. We don't need five, six ACA carriers to deal with. So that keeps us focused on what we need to do, and when we talk to a broker here's our product, our portfolio is very simple, but it's quality products, quality carriers. So yeah, we don't try to spread out I've tried that before when I first opened up my brokerage agency and it's just you spread yourself too thin, you don't do anybody justice.

Ryan Eaton: You have some great points there. Don't try to be everything to everybody and the power of focus. We talk about that all the time here because there's a guy, Craig Rochelle, great leadership speaker. And he says when you're successful, distractions will show up at your doorstep dressed like opportunities. And it's one of my favorite quote, because when you're doing something good, every other carrier wants to meet with you and once you just start selling their products to next thing, you got, you can't even keep up with all the names of the products, much less what they're like in the market and how their systems and their admin companies work and all the different things there so I think that's great advice, Mark so, you had two great points there, and it might even go into my next question I had for you but you may have something different. What has been your key to long term success? You've been doing this for 33 years. You've had your own company for 20 years. What's been your biggest key to long term success?

Mark Lampen: Persistency, of course, I never got away from what I really when I started the business It was door knocking it was getting out of the field. And that's a lost art these days. Insurance is a relationship building and with Obamacare came into play, we've seen a lot of these carriers or company reps. They were no longer out in the field when COVID hit, everything's done by zoom. You adapt to stuff like that, but there's nothing better getting out in the field, knocking on doors, talking to new agents, bringing new ideas to them. So I never strayed from that. And, you mentioned my son, he's been in the business with me now, five years it's flown by and he's dealt with that. We started training them, knocking on doors and getting rejections and overcoming them and just like every other salesperson does. And he was getting going full tilt, a lot of steam and COVID hits. Now we started what I call dialing for dollars. We're picking up the phone. We can't see people that was frustrating, he still did good, but now COVID's passed. He's out in the field and he's built up his, agent base and, a lot of it's been by knocking on doors. Now we still do the email blast and get in front of agents that way we adapted technology or he helps me adapt to technology. But there's nothing better than just going out there and talking to an agent face to face, or you get a better feeling. You get a better quality agent, in my opinion, by doing that.

Ryan Eaton: I couldn't agree more. When I first got started, I was selling Medicare supplements back in the early 2000s and I had a goal where every day I would call 100 people. And that was my goal. Every day, I said, if I can just sell, three to four a day or get three, anywhere from, somewhere 10 to 12 appointments. I can probably sell three to four of them and that was my goal. And it is, it's persistency. And I agree with you, I think it is a lost art. There's a lot of people that aren't doing that. There's some people are religious to it and they do a great job, but I think a lot of people don't want to, don't want to say no, would rather put something on social media or email and just wait for the phone to ring and it what work like that. No, that's great. So look next question is, in what ways as your strategies helped you overcome chall companies may not face?

Mark Lampen: Well, the larger company of course, they've got branding recondition. Whether it be a health carrier, or maybe a big general agencies and staff so overcome the brand recondition, news, health insurance specialist. What do you do? Never heard of you. So, the way we overcome that is actually getting out in the field. One of our best brokers has been writing with us for about 12, 13 years gap business. Bob Blankenship he's about an hour south and Bob knows this project inside out, but I treat my brokers as a team, even though he's sold, I don't know how many groups over the years, he still wants me to go on the presentations with him. You work as a team and it gives, when you bring in a new idea to an employer to think outside the box, when you bring someone with the expertise that, I do a company rep and they're meeting with you face to face, it gives a lot of that validity, to the product. It gives them a little bit of comfort and if you're going to be there, I give him a card, you call me, if Bob doesn't answer, you call me so those are the things that the little things I try to set myself apart from these big brokerage houses who still don't have, like I say, probably getting out in the field as much as I do, or as my son does.

Ryan Eaton: That's a great personal touch. And I can't tell you how many times, and you work with Sherry here at our office directly. Sherry has told me multiple times. [00:13:00] How she'll get there and meet with someone, and they get there and say, we haven't had a carrier come visit us in years. And so, I think the two on those lines is the same thing on the GA side. A lot of people, they may take their top 10 to 15 brokers out, but most of these people aren't getting that personal touch.

And I think doing that, it makes all the difference in the world when you can break bread with somebody, look them in their eyes not through a screen, but actually sitting out with them, go play a round of golf, whatever the case may. be, it's a huge differential in the markets, that's good. What impact or value do your relationships with your clients, with your brokers have that go beyond just the sales?

Mark Lampen: I told my son when he came into the business, I said, I built this up over the last of that time, 15 years or so. My name is everything out there, you are health insurance specialists, and.

Ryan Eaton: That's right.

Mark Lampen: Service, service. We may sit there and help sell the case. We may quote the case. We may train them on the case. What does that service aspect truly that I go back to? And we are a big believer in that. We probably over service. We get calls six, seven o'clock at night. A lot of company reps, their phones off, we'll pick up if we could pick up or not around family, whatever, we'll do it. It's not a big deal. I'll return emails at 10, 11 o'clock at night, knowing that they're going to have that first thing in the morning. So, it's service. I can't tell you how many times Ryan over the years that brokers sit there and say, you know what, I try to call my rep. It may be fourth quarter, it may be three, four days later, they finally get back to you.

Ryan Eaton: That didn't work.

Mark Lampen: No.

Ryan Eaton: They've moved on by that point. Yeah.

Mark Lampen: Absolutely. You've lost your client.

Ryan Eaton: That's exactly right. So, my next question I had, which is, I'm going to change it up just a little bit, because what we said, it was, what are your agency partners and clients expect from you, but you hit that already. They've gotten that point. Now you built that level of expectation, which you're always going to be there. You put your integrity and your character first in your business. How important do you think? Putting your integrity, your character is compared to the guy who's just trying to sell a policy. What do you think that differential is?

Mark Lampen: We sit there trying to do the right thing for the right reasons. If our product doesn't fit, we'll tell somebody it doesn't fit, we're not trying to put a square peg in a round hole.

Ryan Eaton: Agree.

Mark Lampen: But what we do what I've learned over the years is I really vet the products that we bring out. Oh, I get calls from carriers all the time. Will you market it? Will you take a look at this? Will you take a look? I'll take a look at it. But if it doesn't improve on what I do, if it doesn't create a better mousetrap, if it doesn't solve a better problem for the agent or the agent's clients. I'm not going to do it. So, I really tried to vet that, and then everything else comes after that, the service and the sales and the training and stuff. But I'm a big believer in that. I could have, 10 gap carriers out there. It doesn't do me any good. Cause I know there's subpar compared to what I currently offer.

Ryan Eaton: There was, when we got started, I remember we got 15 contracts with Medicare supplement carriers when I was selling direct to individual clients back in the day, and I remember you got all these contracts and you had everything ready to be able to say, okay, someone that had a lower rate, someone was a smoker or not a smoker or whatever the rates would adjust, but at the end of the day, you only want to write with maybe two of them, maybe three of them, because everyone had these one offs. They took forever on the writing, couldn't get the claims team on the phone. You couldn't get the service team. The billing was off. You want to work with the right people and that helps you look good as well too on what you do when you vetted them out like that. You're not just giving everybody everything they asked for. Kind of back to your first point. I think that's brilliant.

Mark Lampen: I've run into a couple companies over the years that I've repped Morgan White being one of them that I know that at the end of the day if there's a hiccup that goes on granted, there's no insurance company It's a hundred percent perfect.

Ryan Eaton: That's right

Mark Lampen: I know if there's a hiccup along the way whether it be a claim a billing whatever. I can sleep at night knowing that it's going to get fixed, and I know who to talk to. And that gives me such a huge peace of mind, especially being in the business 33 years. I don't need to play those games that some of these other Agencies or brokers try to play. I'm a big believer in that.

Ryan Eaton: Mistakes are going to happen whether the group forgets to take someone off a bill, who's passed away or left the company, agents are going to forget to get something signed or maybe check a certain box carriers are going to forget to process a claim a certain way, whatever the case may be on a draft on a certain day of the month. You want to make sure you got people in your corner, who's going to get in the dish with you. If something's off, not, oh, sorry, you did this, I agree and I think that's the relationship side of it, that if you have it carries weight in our industry. Cause like you said, it's a relationship. business. And if you don't have that relationship, you don't know who to call or you don't have those people who will get in the ditch with you it makes, it's a big difference for sure.

You've been in the business now, 33 years, you've got your son in the business, as your business continues to scale and grow cause we've seen it grow in every single year. How do you help with the scaling of that business as it grows, what's that look like for you?

Mark Lampen: I want to make sure that we're growing in the right way. By that, we're able to service that business. The new agents we bring in, it's all about bringing in new agents to sell them. The GAAP plan, believe it or not, as great of a product as it is, there's so many agents out there that are not even aware of the GAAP plan, or the power of the GAAP plan, or they're afraid to market it to their, first client and what have you. So, we want to make sure that we could not only service but train, educate, get that agent comfortable first. So, as we grow, we want to make sure that service aspect does not drop off. And one way that we do that, quite honestly, is with your team, Ryan. I know a broker email me a question, hey, we forgot to add somebody on. I know who to go to in your company. Sherry and Chrissy are phenomenal.

Ryan Eaton: They are.

Mark Lampen: I pawn it off to them. For a better time. And I know it's going to get.

Ryan Eaton: They're good at it.

Mark Lampen: Phenomenal at it. So, when you have a team like that behind you, people say, you know what, you're a two-man shop, I'm a two-man shop with some great companies behind me. And that's the heart and soul of our agency. We have so much faith in our carrier partners and the service that we get, otherwise we wouldn't be writing. If we couldn't get our questions answered, we couldn't continue to grow, we probably would find another carrier. We found homes with some great carriers, whether it be group or individual or gap or whatever. And we try to stay focused, but we want to make sure we've got the support from those companies. And I can't say enough good things about Morgan White, because. Like I say, it makes me look good. I get an answer back. I'm on appointments and stuff, and they think, man, that's great. So welcome back to that service aspect. You guys do a great job.

Ryan Eaton: I appreciate that compliment, I've always felt like when I used to be in the field, it was one of those things that it's hard to know if you're working with 10 different carriers, let's just say across four or five product lines knowing everybody's system, how their billing works, how their portals work to be able to access. It's hard, it's just if you had 10 different bank accounts with 10 different companies and everyone's bill pays a little [00:20:00] bit different, everyone's account summaries are different. All the different things. So, it's nice having people at the company who can help train on that and be able to work with you on that and you're right. Sherry and Chrissy do a phenomenal job. So, I appreciate you saying that about them. So, look, what would you say is the biggest compliment that you could get from one of your clients today.

Mark Lampen: It depends whether it's a broker or an employer, an employee, or.

Ryan Eaton: Both of them.

Mark Lampen: I work in conjunction with a large MGA, national MGA. They could write gap business. I've partnered with those agents here that when they feel the need for a gap, they don't want to do it because there goes back to the thing, too many things out there. They're going to the expert. I just got a lead from a guy out in Nebraska from one of these company reps, and that shows me the faith, they put in the email, you're gonna get great service, you're gonna get all your answers answered, you're gonna get trained, so on and so forth. So that makes me feel good when they could sell the same product, but they're using me as the go to person and brokers all the time, it goes back to, Hey, you're available, you're not hiding behind a phone and our computer and answered it two, three days later. You get right to it. I'm one of those guys that get that email. It's off.

Ryan Eaton: That's right.

Mark Lampen: I don't care if I'm on vacation, I'll work an hour in the morning and stuff. Go through that stuff. I don't want 400 emails a week later when I get back. And it doesn't take that much effort, it really doesn't.

Ryan Eaton: I can back you up on that, I know you sent me emails when you've been on vacation before following up on different things and so I know you're working hard there. So, look, last question I got for you then, Mark, we're going into fourth quarter. What's fourth quarter look like for you?

Mark Lampen: It's going to be a good one. I really feel it, I'm anxious to get it going, I can't wait for these group renewals to get in. We've got a big GA in Southern Illinois that works solely with Blue Cross. They're looking forward to it because they're looking for answers. And we've partnered with them, to bring it out to their brokers gap strategy and it's going to be a great fourth quarter, not only with the gap business, but some of our other products. We've been laying this groundwork for months, I always say, if you're not out there knocking on doors in the slow months, the April, March, March, April, May, June, you're going to be behind, the ball come fourth quarter, cause nobody wants to talk to you a fourth quarter they're too busy with everything else going on.

Ryan Eaton: I've started even hearing now that a lot of agencies will say we do not have any more carrier visits or outside visits, unless it's a client after 10 one, just because there is so much going on, cause I guess it's 70 percent of the business now. For news between 10 one and one, one, and everyone's so busy that it's just, we got to cut off those visits. So, I agree 100%, you got to get it early.

Mark, man, I can't tell you how much I appreciate you being on the show today. And it's an honor to have you here, you're a great partner, I appreciate all the kind words you said too.

Mark Lampen: It's a great company to work with and partner with, it's really a blessing

Ryan Eaton: We'd like to thank you for listening today to another episode of the Insurance Leadership Podcast, where a good plan today is better than a great plan must for now. Thank you for listening.